Legislature(2009 - 2010)BARNES 124
04/09/2009 03:00 PM House ENERGY
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB163 | |
| HB182 | |
| HB191 | |
| HB148 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HB 191 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 148 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 163 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 182 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
HB 163-ALASKA NATURAL GAS DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY CO-CHAIR EDGMON announced that the first order of business would be HOUSE BILL NO. 163, "An Act clarifying the purpose of the Alaska Natural Gas Development Authority; and relating to definitions of certain terms in AS 41.41." 3:08:23 PM JOE BALASH, Special Staff Assistant, Office of the Governor, informed the committee the governor introduced HB 163 to broaden the authority of the Alaska Natural Gas Development Authority (ANGDA). The authority originally was created with statutory authority to take North Slope gas to tidewater. Previous changes to the statutes in 2004 were made in order to also review Cook Inlet in addition to Prince William Sound as a tidewater destination. This bill would allow ANGDA to consider gas supplies other than the North Slope for destinations in Southcentral Alaska. The committee took an at-ease from 3:10 p.m. to 3:11 p.m. 3:11:44 PM CO-CHAIR EDGMON asked Representative Ramras to introduce his amendment. REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS made a motion to adopt Amendment 1, as follows: Page 1, line 1, following "Authority;": Insert "relating to prior approval by the governor or the commissioner of revenue before the exercise of certain powers of the Alaska Natural Gas Development Authority;" Page 2, following line 7: Insert new bill sections to read: "* Sec. 3. AS 41.41.200 is amended to read: Sec. 41.41.200. Powers of the authority. In furtherance of its corporate purposes, in addition to its other powers, and subject to the approval by the governor under AS 41.41.210, the authority may (1) sue and be sued; (2) adopt a seal; (3) adopt, amend, and repeal bylaws and regulations; (4) make and execute contracts and other instruments; (5) in its own name acquire property, lease, rent, convey, or acquire real and personal property; a project site or part of a project site may be acquired by eminent domain; (6) acquire natural gas supplies; (7) issue bonds and otherwise incur indebtedness in accordance with AS 41.41.300 - 41.41.410 in order to pay the cost of a project; (8) accept gifts, grants, or loans from and enter into contracts or other transactions regarding gifts, grants, or loans with a federal agency or an agency or instrumentality of the state, a municipality, private organization, or other source; (9) enter into contracts or agreements with a federal agency, agency or instrumentality of the state, municipality, or public or private individual or entity, with respect to the exercise of its powers; (10) charge fees or other forms of remuneration for the use of authority properties and facilities; (11) defend and indemnify a current or former member of the board or an employee or agent of the authority against the costs, expenses, judgments, and liabilities as a result of actions taken in good faith on behalf of the authority; and (12) purchase insurance to protect its assets, services, and employees against liabilities that may arise from authority operations and activities. * Sec. 4. AS 41.41 is amended by adding a new section to article 2 to read: Sec. 41.41.210. Required approval. (a) The authority may not exercise the power in AS 41.41.200(5), (6), (7), (8), or (9) without the prior written approval of the governor after the governor finds that the project proposed or being developed by the authority is in the best interest of the state. The governor shall give written notice to the authority of the approval or denial of approval. (b) The authority may not exercise the power in AS 41.41.200(4) without the prior written approval of the commissioner of revenue after the commissioner of revenue finds that the execution of the contract or other instrument is in the best interest of the state. The commissioner of revenue shall give written notice to the authority of the approval or denial of approval. (c) The written approval or denial of approval in (a) or (b) of this section is a final administrative action for purposes of appeal to the superior court." Renumber the following bill sections accordingly. CO-CHAIR EDGMON objected for the purpose of discussion. 3:11:58 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS expressed increasing alarm at ANGDA's recklessness and inability to "play well with others." He offered his support for Governor Palin's efforts for an in-state bullet line. He opined the state faces a unique situation, in which the governor's project manager, Harry Noah, and the chief executive officer of ANGDA, Harold Heinz, seem to disagree since Harold Heinze seems to want to "pull the state in another direction." He explained that HB 163 clarifies the purpose of ANGDA, but also expands its authority. He referred members to proposed section 4 of Amendment 1, and read: The authority may not exercise the power in AS 41.41.200(5),(6),(7),(8), or (9) without the prior written approval of the governor after the governor finds that the project proposed or being developed by the authority is in the best interest of the state. The governor shall give written notice to the authority of the approval or denial of approval. REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS described ANGDA as a dysfunctional group, and one that is not following the instructions of the state. He opined ANGDA has a spotty record of following its specific instructions in the past six months. He suggested that this amendment would give more control to the governor and represents good public policy. With respect to other sections of Amendment 1, section 3 would address the Beluga to Fairbanks (B2F) project. He recalled hearing pipeline safety staff's concern at a recent energy convention over proposed black plastic pipe being buried in the ground from Glenallen to Beluga. Thus, this amendment will prevent the state from taking responsibility for that project. He reiterated that proposed section 4 will place ANGDA under the governor, at least during a period of time until the state has more clarity of how ANGDA will function as a productive quasi-entity within the state. 3:15:47 PM MR. BALASH reviewed the amendment. He cautioned that he would not speak for the administration or the governor on Amendment 1. He pointed out that rarely does the governor make a finding in statute, that those are typically duties assigned to a commissioner with expertise in the matters at hand. 3:16:43 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS stressed that in this instance it is in the best interest of the state for the governor to have more authority in this regard. He recalled a news report that ANGDA failed to recognize the direction the state is headed on this issue. He feared that ANGDA was trying to set energy policy for the state. He preferred the governor provide leadership on the issue of an in-state gas pipeline and not a committee. 3:17:45 PM CO-CHAIR EDGMON pointed out that HB 163 has two more committees of referral. He stated that he allowed Representative Ramras to introduce Amendment 1 as a concept. He then asked Representative Ramras to withdraw the amendment. 3:18:19 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS withdrew Amendment 1. CO-CHAIR EDGMON withdrew his objection. 3:18:38 PM BOB FAVRETTO, Member, Alaska Natural Gas Development Authority (ANGDA) Board of Directors, Department of Revenue (DOR), related that he felt somewhat disturbed by Representative Ramras comments. He stressed the importance of recent dialogue at the ANGDA board meetings. He wished Representative Ramras had heard dialogue the ANGDA board had at those recent meetings. Additionally he suggested that Mr. Heinze could echo comments to the board. 3:19:38 PM MR. FAVRETTO, in response to Representative Ramras, answered that the statutes clearly state that ANGDA has the authority over the proposed in-state natural gas pipeline and not Harry Noah, who is a representative appointed by the governor. He explained that it was somewhat unclear initially at the meetings as to the authority, but by the end of the meeting it was clear that moving the pipeline forward is a shared goal of both Mr. Heinze and Mr. Noah. 3:20:32 PM HAROLD HEINZE, Chief Executive Officer, Alaska Natural Gas Development Authority (ANGDA), Department of Revenue (DOR), stated that he has not seen Amendment 1. He said that he takes exception to the characterization by Representative Ramras with respect to ANGDA. He offered that the past several months have been difficult due to a number of restrictions made by the administration. He explained that ANGDA has evolved from 2003, and especially last year with the governor's challenge to provide energy relief to communities in the Interior. Thus, ANGDA's efforts to modify the spur line to Fairbanks using Cook Inlet natural gas. Additionally, ANGDA revisited its long-term plan with respect to propane, in an effort to develop an opportunity to transport North Slope gas in the form of propane from the Beaufort Sea to western Alaska, and along the highway system to Fairbanks. Additionally, ANGDA's main focus has been to continue to work with Denali and TransCanada on the proposed gas pipeline. He expressed ANGDA's focus and emphasis on capturing the benefits of the intrastate commerce and for the state achieve the best consumer terms for intrastate commerce requires the ANGDA participate in the open season. Further, he opined that the routes under consideration for natural gas would require intermediate steps to bridge the gap until the availability of North Slope gas. He characterized ANGDA's efforts as being on target with the governor's program. He said he found it difficult to understand how ANGDA could be considered unresponsive to the needs of the governor. 3:24:33 PM MR. HEINZE stated the purpose of HB 163 is to clarify ANGDA's long-term broad authority. He specified that many people believe ANGDA's purpose is to build a project. However, although it has that ability, ANGDA's emphasis is to move the project forward in the early stages, reduce risk for the private sector, and provide opportunities for financing so that the ultimate consumer receives the benefit. 3:25:18 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS asked Mr. Heinze to define ANGDA's relationship with the governor's in-state gas pipeline chief, Harry Noah. MR. HEINZE answered that Mr. Noah has been charged to work on a project for the governor that links the North Slope directly to areas inside the state without any dependence on gas from a large pipeline. He underscored ANGDA's cooperation and support for the in-state gas pipeline chief. 3:26:50 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS refined his question and specifically asked whether he was "working with Mr. Noah" or if he was "deferential to Mr. Noah and the governor" with respect to building the proposed in-state gas bullet line. MR. HEINZE answered that ANGDA has not been working on a bullet line or a line directly to the North Slope, but ANGDA supports that effort. He offered that the bullet line is one of several important options for the state. At the same time, ANGDA will pursue on a parallel track other efforts it has begun, such as to pursue the spur line, which would tap into a main line to Canada to bring some of the North Slope gas to markets in Southcentral Alaska. He conceded that a spur line may not benefit communities such as Fairbanks but will benefit other communities in the Cook Inlet area providing significant advantages over a bullet line. In further response to Representative Ramras, Mr. Heinze said it seems that AS 41.41 is clear on authority. He referred to a memorandum dated April 7, 2009 from Lisa Weissler and Larry Ostrovsky, Department of Law, that clarifies the actions ANGDA has taken are well within the statutory authority. He said he was not aware of any instructions from the governor that are counter to anything in the statutes. 3:28:12 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS repeated his question, and asked whether Mr. Heinze is deferential to Mr. Noah. 3:29:33 PM MR. HEINZE, in further response to Representative Ramras, explained he personally reports to the Board of Directors of ANGDA. He highlighted that the board has been very clear that ANGDA is to work in full cooperation with the governor's chief of the in-state pipeline. He understood that Mr. Noah represents the project to go to the North Slope directly for gas. At the same time, the board has not accepted that Mr. Noah has authority over matters that are prescribed in statute for ANGDA's authority. He offered his belief that AS 41.41 is clear, that he also submitted a memorandum (memo) from the attorney general that ascertains that ANGDA actions are within its authority. 3:30:24 PM MR. HEINZE then drew attention to the previously mentioned memorandum from the assistant attorneys general dated April 7, 2009. He offered his belief that the memo makes it clear that ANGDA has operated within its statutory authority and will continue to do so. He said in the long run that the bill will be helpful with respect to the bonding and banking instruments. He asked members to consider passing HB 163. 3:31:41 PM TOM LAKOSH began his testimony by first qualifying that he is representing himself and is not an attorney. He understood that ANGDA has determined it is an undue burden for ratepayers in Southcentral Alaska to build a bullet line. He also understood that Representative Ramras is interested in a subsidy for his constituents prior to building the main gas pipeline. He opined that the public interest and ratepayers would be better served to stop the export of natural gas and developing the rest of the gas from Cook Inlet and still provide free propane to Fairbanks. He suggested state exploration and production in Cook Inlet would be much cheaper than a spur line or a bullet line. He further suggested exploring other options for Fairbanks for heating and gas supply. 3:35:23 PM PAUL D. KENDALL commented that all Alaskans seem to talk about is natural gas. He said he thinks that Anchorage and the Matanuska-Susitna area could be converted to electric by using water and wind technology. He offered that if the state is going to propose a gas pipeline that he would like to see the specific proposal. He stated he would like to see an itemization of the name of each user, the amount of the use, and certify the use, such as a list of schools and the amount of usage. This would show the public who is using the gas and then the entities can pay for it. If school districts want to use fossil fuels, then he should not have to pay for their use of outdated technology, he opined. Additionally, he further stated he would like to see the total revenue and itemized expenditures for the costs of securing natural or piped gas. In closing, he said he thinks the overall problem stems from not having a defined energy policy. He recommended a four to five day forum to assess wind, electric, and solar energy. He stressed the importance of an open process and not to allow proprietary or secret information. 3:40:39 PM PAUL FUHS stated that he is representing himself, as a consumer of gas in Southcentral. He presented written information from the Western Alaska Energy Corridor, which was presented as the reason for the drafting of HB 163. He related that he had discussed an idea with some people at the Donlin Creek LLC, a Barrick NovaGold company with respect to running a spur line to pick up the big mines. [The Donlin Creek LLC proposes to work with the residents of the Yukon Kuskokwim to develop a gold mine 13 miles north of the Middle Kuskokwim River village of Crooked Creek.] He expanded by explaining this was a potential means of supplying villages in Western Alaska with energy. He opined that ANGDA's authority was limited geographically. Thus, HB 163 was drafted to remedy that issue. He stated that this bill would allow ANGDA to work in other parts of the state outside of the main pipeline corridor. He opined that another instance might be if a gas pipeline goes through Canada that a smaller pipeline could be built to Haines or down the Taku River to Southeast Alaska. He noted that the statutes provide that the board is appointed by the governor. He also offered his belief that a problem of cooperation between ANGDA and the in-state pipeline does not exist. 3:42:44 PM MR. FUHS, in response to Representative Johansen, stated he supports HB 163 to allow ANGDA to work in other areas of the state. He pointed out that the letter on the back of his handout is from Senator Lyman Hoffman asking ANGDA to analyze this proposal and perform a baseline analysis for feasibility. He stated that the Department of Law answered that the statutes do not allow ANGDA to operate outside the pipeline corridor. 3:43:10 PM REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN stated he thought Mr. Fuhs should have provided the information sooner to allow members to digest new information. MR FUHS apologized. 3:44:02 PM CO-CHAIR EDGMON, after first determining no one else wished to testify, closed public testimony on HB 163. 3:44:12 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS commented that he did not hear an answer from Mr. Heinze. He stated that it was unclear how ANGDA operates, but the bill expands the authority of ANGDA. He said that he would not support HB 163. He opined that the bill gives more authority to ANGDA, when ANGDA has not currently demonstrated it can move responsibly with the administration. 3:45:53 PM REPRESENTATIVE DAHLSTROM moved to report HB 163, Version 26- GH1057\A out of committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes. 3:46:10 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS objected. A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Johansen, Tuck, Dahlstrom, and Edgmon voted in favor of HB 163. Representatives Ramras and Petersen voted against it. Therefore, HB 163 was reported out of the House Special Committee on Energy by a vote of 4-2. 3:47:19 PM The committee took an at-ease from 3:46 p.m. to 3:48 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| CSHB182(ENE) Legal Memo.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 182 |
| Changes from HB191 to CS.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| CSHB182(ENE).pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 182 |
| HB148 Leg Reseaarch Dec 2008.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 148 |
| HB148 Leg Research Feb 2009.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 148 |
| HB148 Sectional.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 148 |
| HB148 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 148 |
| HB148 Fiscal Note.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 148 |
| HB163 Fiscal Note 1.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 163 |
| HB163 Fiscal Note 2.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 163 |
| HB148 Fiscal Note2.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 148 |
| HB191 Anchorage.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| HB191 CS.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| HB191 Fiscal Note.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| HB191 Fiscal Note2.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| Hb191 Generation Reactors.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| Hb191 Licensing.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| HB191 Power Point.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| HB191 Nuclear Waste.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |
| HB191 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HENE 4/9/2009 3:00:00 PM |
HB 191 |